The first post, and surely now the second one responding to the first, by Wintersun main man Jari Mäenpää on Facebook has caused a bit of controversy in the worldwide metal community online. Sifting through some of the responses and comments by other metal heads and on other websites (they’re fairly easy to find if you want to look for yourself), reactions seem to fall into two categories. There are the fanboys and fangirls who figure Jari is a god, can do no wrong, wholeheartedly agree and would probably donate half their savings to his crowd funding campaign. It is actually a little bit unnerving that some segments of the fan base have created something almost akin to a cult around this band.
The other category of responses seem to be the more realistic ones. Or at least the type of responses that most people would have when reading this type of thing. Honestly, Jari’s posts could have been left at a point where he stated that he would like to try a crowd funding campaign. There really was no need for an attempt to justify why and no need to badmouth Nuclear Blast to that extent. Which is what was done, whether Jari now attempts to deny it or not. If I was someone with the power to add and drop bands from the record label, I’d be considering doing so to Wintersun at this point. Record labels are a business, fair or not, and in business it is never a good idea to bite the hand that feeds. Although according to Jari, Nuclear Blast has been starving him.
Why publicly complain about living in a ‘small shitty apartment building’ with neighbours? Guess what Jari? You are not in a unique situation, no matter how many times you attempt to prove that you are. Many creative people live in spaces that aren’t that conducive to being creative. Creativity, whether in the form of art, music or some other endeavor typically doesn’t result in monstrous pay cheques and most realize and accept this. Poor Jari has to change his sleep patterns and can’t record all instruments properly in his home. Sounds familiar? I would think so to anyone who has a hobby, or to anyone who has to work a ‘regular’ job to pay the bills while still trying to do what they enjoy.
Blaming the record label for the amount of time it has taken to create an album due to lack of money... This must be something that no other band has ever struggled with. If the record label is the problem, figure out a way to pay whatever associated penalties and get out of the contract. Do it all yourself Jari. See what it feels like to release material without being signed to a label. Many musicians find a way to release material independently, at least for a while, so it is obviously possible. But then again, most people aren’t egotistical perfectionists to the extent that Jari has just proven that he is. Most recognize that unless you have an unrealistic amount of money, things may not be quite perfect and compromise might have to be made. If Jari feels like he’s a slave to the system for being able to do something that most musicians would love to be able to do, maybe he should quit the music industry and go back to that job in the post office that he lovingly references.
As for the second post: more megalomaniacal, egotistical drivel. Complaining about having to finance musical endeavors out of your own pocket? There are plenty of bands that do this; they do it without record label support or without the type of promotion that can be possible when signed to a record label. They don’t typically see advances to make albums. Surprise Jari: they typically don’t make money, but you sure don’t see many other musicians crying, bitching and complaining to this extent. At least not publicly. If Jari wants a studio so badly, maybe he should have built it long ago. These “problems” with all of the existing studios and equipment don’t seem like they popped up overnight. But then again, it is doubtful that the problems lay with everyone and everything other than Jari, who appears to be the common denominator. Saying he is one man with limited resources and limited skills: welcome to the non-fantastical world that he claims he lives in.
Suggesting that people have “personal problems” for thinking the idea of crowd funding Jari’s fantasy studio is overstepping boundaries. Not everyone is blindly going to jump on the “poor Jari, with so many hardships and struggles” band wagon. I don’t see how this situation is more unique than someone else’s, other than perhaps of the snooty, perfectionist attitude, turned around in an attempt to garner sympathy. Making excuses doesn’t work when you show your true colors like this. It reminds of a certain vocalist, and a certain album titled ‘Chinese Democracy’.
I’m glad I don’t own any Wintersun material or merchandise. After this lovely showing, I would be ashamed if I had to admit I owned albums, or would be ashamed to wear merchandise. I didn’t mind Wintersun’s music, but I failed to see how it was on a level that other bands could not possibly even reach. Whether it was intended to or not, both of these posts came across as a big “fuck-you” to other musicians and metal heads, who somehow cannot possibly understand the struggles and “unique situations” that poor Jari has been forced to endure. For someone who must believe they are a genius, you would think some of these opinions would not have been posted in such a public forum. As it so often does, the arrogance won out over the better judgement. People don’t need this kind of an explanation to crowd fund projects. Most people have some idea of the hardships that musicians can endure, and have some idea of what happens with record labels. There will be those who have a differing opinion from me regarding this and that’s okay. There are enough other great bands out there, that manage to release some fantastic material under all of these hardships and restraints that plague Wintersun, that I will continue to support them and forget about Wintersun.
For reference, these are the posts made to Facebook:
Reality Update About Crowd Funding, TIME II And Future Albums
I´m very happy to see that we have so much dedicated fans that would be willing to pledge and be a part of funding a studio for Wintersun, so I could make the next Wintersun album without it taking another 10 years again.
I´ve been thinking about this Kickstarter/Pledge crowd funding thing for a while and I´m very confident now that there is enough of you guys that would help us raise the money for the Wintersun studio! This would give me the freedom to make music efficiently and nonstop. It would eliminate lot of the problems I´ve struggled with all my life and still continue to struggle everyday. For example right now I need a studio to reamp guitars for TIME II. And not just any studio, my own studio where I can craft my sounds exactly like I want them. 3rd party studios have never worked for me and I´ve never gotten satisfactory results for the insane prices they charge.
I live in a small shitty apartment building and I have neighbors. It is very very hard to work like this. I can´t record vocals, I can´t practise my singing, I can´t record guitars, I can´t record guitars even with modelling amps, because the electricity is so bad in this shitty building so I get lots of interference, I even play and practise the electric guitar acoustically without an amp 99% of the time in my home, I can´t record drums or basically any acoustic instruments, I don´t have the room or cool space for a big computer farm which is a must for the orchestrations for the next album (the place is too small and hot even for the one computer I have), I can´t mix properly, ´cause the room is so bad and there´s always ambient noise in and outside the building. That´s why I usually turn my sleeping rhythm around and mix at nights, but that causes problems in my everyday life. I can´t do pretty much anything properly in this situation. Building a professional studio for Wintersun would erase all this and give us the freedom to make music nonstop. It would upgrade our album sound significantly and most importantly speed up the album making process significantly. This would even raise our live game. With proper preproduction, able to tweak our live sounds and setup properly we would sound pretty incredible live. We would also be able to rehearse more and that would allow us to be able to play live more often and come to places where we normally have not been able to come. The studio would allow us to have more time for everything.
But the problem is this. I have a record deal with Nuclear Blast. If I would do a Kickstarter with a downloadable album for example, they would come with lawyers and take % share (more than half) away from the money that is your money meant for the Wintersun studio and the album production. Would you even want to pledge if Wintersun didn´t get 100% of the money you´ve pledged for the album production? Then our management would take their % share away. Then there´s taxes of course. The Finnish government would take something like 40% away. This would leave me nothing. I would be totally screwed. I´ve been trying to have a discussion with Nuclear Blast about crowd funding, but they are totally freaking out. They see the crowd funding as a threat to their business and they would rather see Wintersun dead, than me doing a crowd funding. I think this would not hurt them at all, only benefit them, but they cannot see the big picture of Wintersun doing well. They actually told me point blank that I should just stop making music and they will never release Wintersun from the contract. It´s really like this, because they can´t or won´t loan me enough money to build a studio and fund an album, they don´t want other people (the fans) to fund it either… unless they get a crazy big cut of the funding (for doing absolutely nothing).
This is the way a record deal works: The label gives an advance to make an album. This is a loan and they will recoup every penny back from the record sales. The reason why TIME I&II has taken so long to make (and still is taking long to finish TIME II), is because I haven´t gotten enough advances (money) to make these complex albums. Not even close. So I´ve been struggling all these years and sacrificed everything to make these albums. I have never really made any money from Wintersun. All my money has gone to album production, but you can guess who have made tons of money from Wintersun. The point is that I need my own studio to make the future albums, but Nuclear Blast won´t be able to loan enough money to make that happen and then they won´t allow me to do a crow funding campaign either that would make it happen. And even if Nuclear Blast would be able to loan me the money for the studio, our management would take their share of that money and I would get only part of the money, but I would still have to pay back 100% to Nuclear Blast from the record sales. So I would actually lose big chunk of the album production money straight away, which makes no sense at all. And then there´s the taxes. So there´s no point of taking these “loans” either.
This all is stressing me out very badly and it´s slowing my workflow. I´ve got enough technical problems to deal with making these albums. I just want the freedom to make music, but I guess it is what it is. Honestly, I feel like I´ve signed a deal with the devil and I´m just a slave in the system.
I´ve got probably 5 long albums worth of new insanely good material! And there´s no filler material at all! The music is much more refined, much more advanced in arrangement/composition/productionwise. It´s diverse and beautiful, heavy, chaotic and exploring different styles&themes and some new dimensions I feel no band has explored before… The stuff is simply on another level, in a different universe than the debut album and the TIME albums combined. I wrote the TIME albums around 2006 and before, that was a lifetime ago. Think of the stuff I´ve written ever since to this day! And I just keep on writing, I feel like I´m on fire. The music is just flowing out of me. I´m so excited about all this new music and I can´t wait to start recording and sharing it with you… BUT I can´t without a studio, that´s the problem…
Jari
p.s. Should have stayed working in the post office!
A status update by Jari on August 7th, 2014:
CLEARING FEW THINGS ABOUT MY LAST “REALITY UPDATE”
I feel like I need to explain the situation more clearly as some people seem to be a bit confused. So let´s get more into the details…
Let´s get one thing clear first, I don´t live in a fantasy world. You might say I´m a bit of a perfectionist when it comes to album production. Fine, I´ll give you that. But I do make compromises, lots of them. TIME I was all a huge compromise. The melody guitars are all old modelling amps (not the new Axe-FXs and whatnots which sound pretty decent actually). There simply was not enough budget to record them properly in a professional studio, so they sound pretty horrible and are very hard mix and fit in with the rest of the instruments. The vocals were all recorded in various rehearsal places just with my laptop (the reason why it took so long to record them and also because of the hundreds of vocal tracks I needed to record for these albums). They are certainly not the best quality vocal recordings. Again, another compromise for not having enough budget for a 3rd party professional studio. I also wanted some time to practise my vocals while recording, which I´ve never really done before, but you can hear the improvement. Also I do some of the vocal arrangement work and experiment with different things while recording, this would be impossible in a 3rd party studio. The rhythm guitars were actually recorded in a 3rd party studio, but I didn´t have enough time to craft the sound exactly like I want it. Rhythm guitar is the thing I´m the most perfectionist and passionate about. There´s only a handful of rhythm guitar sounds I like from the millions of heavy metal records out there, so you can imagine how hard it is for me to be able to produce the guitar sound of my dreams in few days in a 3rd party studio. Impossible. And to fit it in with hundreds of orchestration & synth instruments, to not muddy the bass, to be able to scoop the mids so the whole mix doesn't sound like a kitchen radio (I don´t like mids in metal guitars plus the orchestra instruments already eat a lot of the mids space), but still keep the upper mids smooth and not harsh, to not mask the drum overheads, but still having enough modern highs and upper mids attack to have it cut through the mix. This is almost a mission impossible, but I know I could do it in my own time in my own studio... So the time ran out from the studio´s “taximeter” and I was left with unsatisfying guitar sound and very hard to fit in the mix (still had to pay the studio bill though). I was very unhappy about this, but still released the album! The orchestrations were made with just one computer which forced me to use time consuming workarounds and was very stressful. I won´t even get into the technical problems I´ve had to deal with over the years. It took 3 years of sweat and tears to make the orchestrations the way I had to do them. This was the hardest task and it nearly burned me out. Never again this way! I would need a computer farm to do the all the orchestrations in realtime without slow workarounds.
I´ve mixed the albums in my apartment and you ask why it takes so long to mix? Well, because my room is not a professional studio ment for mixing. There´s also always some noise issues inside and outside the building, I´ve had even some scary hearing problems due to this for having to raise the volume and having to mix too loud. Never again! There´s also insane amount of tracks to mix (which is very difficult), but my computer is having hard a time handling them well. Very unstable and slow. But the main thing why the mixing takes so long is because the recorded sounds are pretty crappy due to lack of resources to record them properly. So it´s very hard to "polish a turd", if not impossible. Good sounds would mix themselves! And I won´t even get into other health problems I´ve had due to stress which has slowed the mixing process too (not mental problems, although maybe I´m a bit crazy :P). So again, I simply can´t afford a 3rd party studios to mix in or to record. Not even close. Nuclear Blast gave us just enough budget for only to record the drums, bass and rhythm guitars in 3rd party studio, that´s it. Which all turn out unsatisfying due to lack of time to tweak the sounds right for massive projects like the TIME albums are. That´s why I´ve been struggling with the mixing. All the rest of the instuments, vocals, orchestrations, melody guitars etc... was left up to me to record on my own however possible and getting quality recordings in a "DIY bedroom studio scenario" is not easy. Sure they gave us few additional advances, ´cause we begged them for faster computers and better gear (and all that money has been paid back already), but still not nearly enough for a task like this. The rest have been basically financed by yours truly with touring, merchandise and just simply sacrificing my own time doing lot of workarounds and recording in rehearsal places or where ever I could due to the lack of funding, but I had to make these albums a reality no matter what! But my point is, as you can see, I do make lots of compromises. TIME I is far from perfect, but still released the album! Would a perfectionist do that?
I certainly can make music renting a 3rd party studio for one month and release an album, as I have already proven that many times in the past. But I won´t do that again, that is my decision. I´ve never been happy with those albums and the results I get from 3rd party studios. Waste of money. There simply isn´t enough time (with our budgets) to craft the sounds the way I want them in unfamiliar space with unfamiliar gear, monitors and under the stress of the “studio taximeter" running. It´s usually just, let´s throw a mic there and wish for the best! “We´ll fix it in the mix... maybe!”. Making music makes me happy. The feeling you get when you first get a new idea, a riff, a melody, a vision of the song is a great feeling and you just want to make that vision come out from the speakers exactly like you hear it in your head. Releasing music that doesn't represent that vision and is compromised makes me unhappy. Why continue to do something that makes you unhappy? Those past albums were like demos to me and nothing like the TIME albums or the future material are in their complexity. I just want to get the production right for these albums! I know some people don't care about the production quality that much, but I do. I wouldn´t be able to ever do these albums in 30, 60 or 90 days in a 3rd party studio “like all the other bands do it”. Sorry, but I´m just not that skilled of a human being! I would need to rent a 3rd party studio for a year or two or even three years depending on the project and live there 24/7. But obviously who can afford that? You could invest and build your own studio with that money and make many albums until you die. The main thing that people need to understand is that the TIME albums and my future material are so much more complex to make than my previous albums were and I just can´t continue to do them like I´ve been forced to do them for the past 10 years. I think we´ve all established by now that this isn´t working. You have to also remember, I do these albums basically alone. Produce, record, engineer, sing, play, mix, master, write all the music & lyrics... Who else does that? Anyone in Finland? Anyone in the world? Well maybe Devin Townsend, but he´s fucking Devin Townsend! I´m just nobody from Konala, Helsinki.
During these years I´ve been already acquiring studio gear and started doing most of the stuff myself and I love it! I´ve gotta pretty good DAW and monitor setup, so basically I got most of the studio gear already. But there´s still one major thing that is missing and that is the studio space. A place to work without interruptions, where I can crank up guitar amps 24/7, 365 days a year without the neighbors calling the cops, to record and practise my singing everyday, to record drums and so on… Having everything always set up ready to record and to mix night or day in a good mixing room would speed up the whole process immensely. It would be also great for the whole band, ´cause we´d have our own rehearsal room for the first time, sort of “Wintersun headquarters”. This would really free us to make albums much faster with better quality and able us to tour more often, which then would open the possibilities financially to other things like upgrading our live shows, doing ten minute music videos for our long songs, a live DVD maybe even with a real orchestra...
It is a fact that without Nuclear Blast I couldn´t have gotten where I am today and I'm certainly grateful of that, but they have really made the most money of Wintersun. What have I made? Well I´ve gotten some better equipments to do my job which is nice, but I´m still struggling and I´m missing the main pieze of the puzzle, the actual "work place”, which is a huge roadblock to continue forwards. I´m in a dead end. All my money has always gone straight to the album productions. I don´t go on vacations, I don´t have a car or anything fancy, which I´m totally fine with! I work and do these albums basically for free and that would be actually fine with me, if I could do my work at least in good conditions. I´ve been struggling and I´ve sacrificed everything for over 10 years and gotten pretty much nothing out of it, except the love and support of the fans, which I appreciate very much!
But to continue to make more albums, I need my own studio. I´ve had enough making albums in rehearsal places and in a bedroom studios, it just doesn´t work. Enough is enough. I´ve reached the breaking point. I don´t owe Nuclear Blast or anyone anything. I don´t have to make or release albums. I don´t have to release TIME II, if I´m not happy with it. I can make music (demos) just for myself for fun and just show them to my closest friends. Or I can do something else, for example teaching like Kai and Teemu... doing anything else I would actually earn some money. I will continue to always make music like I did before any record deals, but whether I will release the music depends totally whether I can record and mix it properly. I´ve made piece with myself that if I won´t be able to ever release another album again and I have to take my songs to the grave, that is ok with me, but I do not wish it. Nuclear Blast and everyone around me has made profits of Wintersun and all my debts are paid. So no harm done. Where to go from here? The future is unknow.
I must point out that our manager is a really good guy. Always has our best interest at heart, he actually gave me a big personal loan to finish TIME I. I couldn´t have done it without him! He actually renegotiated a better Nuclear Blast deal for me after the TIME I release. I´m actually ok with the new deal. Except for the fact that I can´t make albums, because they won´t fund them enough for me to actually be able to make them and at the same time they are denying me doing a Wintersun crowd funding which probably would finance the studio. So they are really holding us hostage. Our manager actually renounced himself from the crowd funding and won´t have any part in it unless I want his help. He wants to see Wintersun succeed. The problem is still the same though, without enough funding there won´t be Wintersun albums. And I´m pretty sure I would not be able to gather enough finances on my own with just “Jari Mäenpää´s studio crowd funding” without any meaningful perk like TIME II high quality album download for example. It would have to be a big Wintersun campaign with a team of people helping me to realise this dream. But I will try to figure something out, I´m not giving up!
TIME II is now in a good place mixwise. I´m pretty happy with the drums, bass & the orchestrations. The whole thing is sounding so much more powerful and clear than TIME I. Really proud of what I´ve been able to achieve with these “not so perfect" recordings and with the intense orchestra layers. It´s so difficult to mix stuff like this, especially with my mixing conditions. But I won´t ruin the hard work I´ve done so far by throwing a crappy guitar sound on top ruining the whole mix. That´s one compromise I won´t make anymore. And I won´t be spending anymore money for 3rd party studios either. I will save and invest every penny for my own studio. Actually for those who complained not hearing the guitars enough on TIME I, the guitars were left purposely little bit back in the mix, because they were so crappy. Or those who critized the production otherwise, now you know the reason why it wasn´t top notch quality. No money = demo quality. And for those who doubted me having written already 5 albums worth of new material, I´ve written actually more. That was just a conservative estimate.
Bottom line, if people want me to make music and release Wintersun albums, I need enough funding for my personal studio where I can craft my music, record and produce my sounds in piece. It is as simple as that. I can´t make this complex music any other way anymore. I am just one man with limited resources and limited skills. I can´t magically pull albums from thin air. Maybe other bands can do their albums “the usual way” renting a 3rd party studio for one month and are happy with the results, I certainly respect that! I´ve been there, done that. I know that many metal bands have all got their own hardships and I am not certainly underrating anyone´s situation. But every situation is unique and mine certainly is. I´ve seen some comments saying that “You don´t deserve your own studio, because other bands don´t get to have their own studio either and you should just do your music like everyone else does it!”. Would it be somehow bad for the other bands if I would build my own studio? Would it somehow hurt the other bands, if I could make more Wintersun albums in my own way? Or are these comments just based on jealousy or something? “What makes you so special to get your own studio?” Nothing and maybe I don´t deserve it, but that is for the fans & financiers to decide and I know there´s lots of dedicated fans that want to support us! It really isn´t about who deserves what. I´m just saying what I can and can´t do. I have my own way of doing things. Sorry, if my previous update sounded like whining or somehow entitled for some of you, it wasn’t ment to be. I am just trying to illustrate the difficult situation I´m in. I definitely understand the realities of life. The crowd funding was actually suggested and brought to my attention by the fans. In fact people have been wanting donate to us since the debut album, but we don't feel very good about it. We always would like to give something back. That's why we make merchandise for example. I admit that I´m a little bit frustrated with the situation, but I´m fine with whatever outcome. But if someone finds it offensive that I´m looking for funding for my studio project and for the Wintersun albums, then they got some personal problems. Most of the comments have been really encouraging, supportive and positive though and I appreciate that!
Currently I´m negotiating with Nuclear Blast and our manager how we could make this work for all parties… We´ll see if we can work this out.
I certainly hope that we´ll find a solution, so we can release more Wintersun albums and share them with the world. It is my dream and passion to make music and it makes me happy to see that so many people care about Wintersun. I´m very grateful!!! All your supportive posts have given me lot of hope and I´m certainly not quitting the fight!
Thank you and thanks for listening!
Jari
p.s. Everyone enjoying their popcorn?
